To Be Baptised - True Meaning.

[michael_legna]

I truly believe that if the person accepted Christ and they died before they were able to get baptized that they would go to heaven.  

A few questions...

1 Corinthians 1
17For Christ did not send me to baptize, but to preach the gospel--not with words of human wisdom, lest the cross of Christ be emptied of its power.

I understand the context of this verse however if Baptism is necessary to our salvation then why would he have said this???  I have asked many people this question and no one can give me a straight answer.

Pauls message is that the preaching of the Gospel is bigger than and more important than one aspect of it.  Baptism after all is just one aspect of all the things we are taught to do to obey the Gospel.  It was just a better use of his time to preach than to baptize, just as Jesus didn't baptize but had his Apostles baptize.

Also, another question if you don't mind is if you have to be baptized to be saved why did the Holy Sprit pour out onto the Gentiles in Acts 10:44-46 before they were baptized??
44While Peter was still speaking these words, the Holy Spirit came on all who heard the message. 45The circumcised believers who had come with Peter were astonished that the gift of the Holy Spirit had been poured out even on the Gentiles. 46For they heard them speaking in tongues[2] and praising God.

Well just because they had the Holy Spirit does not mean they were saved in a final absolute sense - what they had was initial salvation.  But Salvation is a process that we must continue in and endure until the end when it is determined at judgement day.  What is more interesting is if Baptism is not needed then why did Peter perform it even after the people had already received the Holy Spirit?

[His_child]

I want to clarify something here.  I do believe we are suppose to baptize with water by the way.  My comments about John 3:5 are in no way trying to prove that baptism shouldn't be done in water.  To be honest I go back and forth with friends of mine for the Church of Christ and they look at John 3:5 and believe that the scripture is stating that unless you are baptized you will not enter the Kingdom of God.  Anyway, just wanted to clarify.  

That is baptismal regeneration.
While I believe that baptism is important and should be done, it is not essential to Salvation.

I can understand how you would not necessarily believe that it is the cause of salvation, but it sure seems to be essential unless oyu can come up with another meaning for the word "except" in John 3:5.

If someone excepts Christ as their Lord and Saviour and suddenly dies before being able to be baptized will they go to Heaven?

Yes just as the thief on the cross did.  It is called baptism of desire.  The act is not the issue the intent is.

For the life of me I can't figure out why someone would choose not to be baptized. However, there are Christians like that.
Would you say that they are saved or not?

BTW- my church teaches baptismal regeneration. It's the only area of my church's doctrine that I disagree with. Actually- my church is divided on that issue so we've pretty much made it a non-issue.
One lady in our church said that she'd been saved for more than 30 years but she didn't want to get baptized because she was afraid of going under water.
The pastor asked her which she was more afraid of doing:
a) going under water
b) explaining to God why she wasn't baptized.
She was the first one in the baptistry the next Sunday.  

[Brother Love]

Amanda,

I agree that faith without works is dead.  The works we do here on this earth do not save us.  The only thing that saves is God's Grace.  
James 2:26 states that faith without works is dead.  I totally agree.  When one has true faith in Christ their lives will show good deeds.  They do not do the good deeds because that is what saves them, they do it out of love for God

I agree with you.  

Pleas let us know what your GOOD WORKS are Ted_Tar

Brother Love

<))><

[Gracey]

Posted by: Brother Love  Posted on: Today at 04:30:44am  
Quote from: Ted_Tar on July 08, 2004, 10:57:26 AM
Amanda,

Quote:
I agree that faith without works is dead.  The works we do here on this earth do not save us.  The only thing that saves is God's Grace.  
James 2:26 states that faith without works is dead.  I totally agree.  When one has true faith in Christ their lives will show good deeds.  They do not do the good deeds because that is what saves them, they do it out of love for God
 

I agree with you.  
 
 

Pleas let us know what your GOOD WORKS are Ted_Tar

Brother Love

<))><  

Why?  

Is it not up to God to look into the hearts of men?

[Brother Love]

Posted by: Brother Love  Posted on: Today at 04:30:44am  
Quote from: Ted_Tar on July 08, 2004, 10:57:26 AM
Amanda,

Quote:
I agree that faith without works is dead.  The works we do here on this earth do not save us.  The only thing that saves is God's Grace.  
James 2:26 states that faith without works is dead.  I totally agree.  When one has true faith in Christ their lives will show good deeds.  They do not do the good deeds because that is what saves them, they do it out of love for God
 

I agree with you.  
 
 

Pleas let us know what your GOOD WORKS are Ted_Tar

Brother Love

<))><  

Why?  

Is it not up to God to look into the hearts of men?

WHY NOT??

<))><

[Gracey]

WHY NOT??

Because it is none of anyone's business except Christ's and the person involved. Our God sees all that we do.

...be careful lest you be entertaining angels unawares

Heb 13:2  Do not be forgetful of hospitality, for by this some have entertained angels without knowing it.

I'm sorry, I just didn't see the point to the question. Yes, I am aware that he posted some very short and negative comments all over the forum. As a believer our behaviour reflects not only on us, but on Christ. Do we lower ourselves, or do we raise up Christ?

blessings
Gracey †