Hi Dan

I don't concur with that conclusion.  Matt.28:19-20 was given to the apostles as well as other disciples.  II Cor.5:20 to the apostles alone, they are the ambassadors, not we.

God bless, duval

Hello Mr. Rogers

Regardles of who introducd I Cor.6:9-11 into out discussion the fact remains it does not say "baptism of the Holy Spirit".  It simply said "by the spirit of our God."  Some make the mistake that everytime they see the word "Spirit" it means "baptism of the Holy Spirit".  Not so.

No, I'm not trying to split hairs nor do I wish to or have to.  You wrote: "the Spirit of our God' is indeed the Holy Spirit."  To that I agree.  But there are different administrations or gifts of the Spirit are there not?   Thus everytime we see "Spirit" it does not always follow it means "baptism of the Spirit."

As for as I Jn.19 which you memtioned you have yet to find where the passage involves the "baptism of the Holy Spirit"  The words "blood" and "cleanses" are in the context but you have no passage ANYWHERE in the NT teaching  that sins are washed or cleansed in Holy Spirit baptism.  If you are holding back on us, please bring them forth.

He Dan

Hi Dan

"the churches of Christ salute you" Rom.16:16.  If this is what they are in the plural, what are they in the singular??

God bless,
duval

Hi Dan

So then have you torn I Jn and like passages out of you Bible??

Consistency, thou art a rare jewel,
duval

Hi Dan

"Might happen"??  Does that not place it in the realm of present possibility?

God bless---duval

Hi again Mr.Rogers

Several scriptures given but did you note before sending them that not a single one of the says anything about Holy Spirit Baptism saving us. 

Very true Paul said he didn't baptize many.  WHO ( in water baptism ) does the baptizing is not of consequence,  but what is of consequence is WHAT baptism and WHY its performed. 

In one of the passages you offered, I Cor.1 Paul said "Christ sent me not to baptize" yet he said he did baptize the household of Stephanan and Crispus and Gaius.  Now what shall we do with Paul for that?

   God bless as you search----duval

Hi Dan

Well I knew the word "rapture" was an anti-scriptural word along with the doctrines frequently associated with the word.

God bless
duval

Hello Dan

Please forward your source for the definite article.

God bless
duval

Hi Mr. Rogers

You wrote today, Dec.17 that  "---water baptism is not and never has been that which saves."  Herein lies our difference!  You also wrote: "It is Jesus through the Holy Spirit that does that."  I agree with that statement but not that it is Jesus through the BAPTISM OF THE HOLY SPIRIT  that does that.  There is a difference as you  surely can see.

You quoted  I Cor.6:9-11.  If your intent was to show that the Corinthians were "washed", "justified" and "sanctified" by the baptism of the Holy Spirit, it doesn't say that either, does it?  It simply says it was "by the Spirit of our God.  I agree with that, but it does NOT say baptism of the Holy Spirit.

Next you quoted 1 Jn.1:9 but the entire chapter is silent on the baptism of the Spirit.

Yes, I agree the word baptize means to "immerse, wash".  So it did witih the baptism of the Holy Spirit in Acts 1:4 and so also it does in Acts 10:47 when Peter asked "can any man forbid water that these should not be baptized-----?

Hi Mr Rogers

Am I correct in understanding that you agree there is only one baptism today?  If so may I ak, which is it?  Holy Spirit?  Fire? Water?  I believe the "one baptism" of Eph.4:5 to be water.

God bless,
duval

Hi Dan

I shall be happy to answer your questions.

All past sins are forgiven when we obey the  gospel of Christ.

Of our present sins I Jn.1 provides good answers about present sin and the conditional word "if".  Vs. 7: "if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship---" there is that word "if". Again, same verse, "---and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin."  Both "fellowship" and the "blood" are conditioned on "if".

I Jn.8: "If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us."  Again the word "if", a conditional word, and John is speaking of the present.  Terrible consequences hang in the balances from this verse.  "If" we say we have no sin (present tense)  number 1 we deceive ourselves and number two, the truth is not in us.

Next verse, I Jn.9:  "if" we confess our sins (present tense) God is "faithful and just to forgive and cleanse".  But conditioned on "if" we do.

Now, I Jn.10:  "If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liiar and his word is not in us."  Again, the conditional word "if".  Again I concliude its dangerous to call God a liar.  The word "IF" is not only conditional but much hangs on it.  But so much for now.

God bless,
duval

Hi Dan

To be honest I thought I got it from you but evidentliy not and I therefore apologise as I will not knowningly misrepresent any man.

God bless,--duval

Hi Mr.Rogers

Regretfully I wrote my post three times before I realized we had come to the end of the page.  I'll figure out how to work this yet.

Now that I'm back on track, I understand from my study of the scriptiure that Holy Spirit baptism is past, fire baptism yet future leaving only water baptism and that being necessary to ones salvatiion.

Thank you again for enduring my 3 repeated posts.
duval

Hi Mr.Rogers

I count at least 3 baptisms in the NT:  1.  Holy Spirit;  2.  Fire;  and 3.  Water.  By the time Paul wrote Eph. 4:5 there was only one baptism left and the baptism of fire was still future following the judgment.  The  baptism that saves us ( Jesus saves us but thru this baptism) is the baptism that is to last till the end of the world.

God bless, duval

Hi Dan

It remains true that Paul was speaking of one one gospel in Gal.1:6-12  With the definite article "the"before the word "gospel" WHAT does that suggest? One or many?   I say one.

Blessed assurance,
duval