I'll tell you what,

Perfect solution....

Dreamweaver-bring the cats
                           cook up the catfish

   and Sincereheart can eat the catfish with the cats

and we'll chomp down on a big ole' plate of crab legs
                               
                                                and shrimp!    
        I'll bring the garlic butter to boot!

[must believe into Jesus to not lose life but to obtain life]

Hmmm.  Well, here again will divide the word and give a more correct visual and understanding as to why some people think you can lose your salvation....unless they chose not to divide the word because of erroneous teaching that they are used to.  This will be a better explanation, I hope, and it is easy to confuse losing your spiritual salvation unless you do dig into the meat, ( if you are ready and willing to allow the Lord to show you the meat).

Referring to Ambassador4Christ's post;  He is exactly correct concerning spiritual salvation, which is the power in total salvation, and is total salvation.  Man is a trichodemy.  He has a spirit, soul, and body.  Therefore, when God promises that "everyone believing into him may not perish, but obtain aionian life" _{John 3:16b} he means that man must believe into Jesus to not lose life but to obtain life that is of the age.  This is the Diaglot's interpretation.  One of the earliest Greek translation's.    

This might be a big blow to those who think working your salvation out means working for the gift God gave you.  If the spiritual salvation from death is a gift, then how often do you pay somebody back for a gift?  Verrrrry simple to understand. You can only work your soul salvation out after you are saved.

Do you really think that what God gave you, sealed, spiritual salvation, can leak back out?  God is not this inadequate in His works. If God seals something, I don't think it's going to leak or escape. Verrry simple to understand.  

Do you actually think that you have your own faith enough to carry out the works that God gives you?  That's like saying, I can do it God, I can do it.  God wants His works through you, but you have to be saved first.  And He gives you faith.  You do not have it on your own.  You only have the decision to follow God's lead.

If you are not saved, to which you can do no works to be saved, and are given the faith, how can your works  keep you saved for the spiritual everlasting?  You are saying that Jesus is not your strength, doesn't totally give you what you need to be saved, and that it's only temporary depending on your will. I might add that you are saying Jesus's total work is not quite enough to save you. Then if that's the case, one must re-evaluate their salvation because, as I wrote before on this thread, there are three salvations.  This spiritual salvation alllows the soul salvation.  But, I think it wasn't understood, which is understandable because there is so much more to substantiate this to which was Paul's Gospel that really needs deeper study opposed to where many stop because the seminarys stop at a certain point.  Nobody wants to shake the bushes.

All saved are saved by the fire because they are saved and sealed.  The works of gold, silver, and precious stones are that of God, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit through you.  This can only happen once you are spritually saved.  This is your life walk after you are saved.  Once you break this down properly, all scriptures that talk about eternal salvation are extremely easy to differentiate between spiritual everlasting salvation and soul salvation.  

You can lose soul salvation, loss of rewards.  Just remember, Hell in the parables actually is Gehenna, which is the anti-type of Gehenna where the people were thrown into a punishing fire.  Gehenna is actually a type of the any-type of Outer darkness.  

The parables are unique in that they are speaking to believers, or pointing out about a child of God's or the walk with God for the examples of what happens ,what will happen, etc.; and point to the levels of a child of God's walk in life and it's consequences.  The hell is not speaking of what some think is for the unbelievers and hot fire.  This is not the original text,(hell).  Therefore, when you separate spirit salvation from soul salvation and remember there are consequences for not losing to soul, which is actually our life walk with the Holy Spirit's conviction of sin and our obedience for the Lord to overcome this sin,  well, it's just a matter of studying .  There's more to a word in translations and that is why we are to divide the word of God.

I may be as brave to speak out about this, not many venture because people have followed a lot of common beliefs, yet when you go to the most earliest translations, such original words are given.

Spiritual salvation-eternal,everlasting-aionian...for ages, or for
   an age -  cannot be lost
Soul salvation-continuous, obedient walk allowing God's will
   worked through you..can lose rewards, Apostates receive
   outer darkness for an age(millenial kingdom age)
Body salvation-ressurected at the rapture
                     redeemed at the Judment seat of Christ
                     or not redeemed until after the 1,000yr. reign
                     of Christ/ which is incidative of apostates, saved but fallen away severly.  This can happen since you cannot lose your salvation.  And salvation by the fruits don't work with this one,(meaning one can be an apostate christian but you wouldn't know he was a christian because he has fallen away) therefore, you cannot become apostate and fall away unless you were saved to fall away.
Read parables in proper context with original wording.  The parables are written in order.  They are, amazingly, a parable.  Haven't you ever ventured far enough to find out who outer darkness is for?

1 Cor.1:18
For this word,(that of the cross,)is indeed foolishness to those who are perishing;  but to those who are *being saved, even to us, it is the Power of God.

*present active, middle participle(gk), continuous action

This is not spiritual salvation that saves us for the everlasting, but it is our continual life walk on this earth,(soul salvation)  This is the most important aspect in our right now, actually, it's the whole idea of our life right now, or it should be, that is if we are saved the right way-without our works.

We cannot have fellowship with God unless we have a relationship with Him.  This relationship is conditional.  We must believe on the Lord Jesus Christ then we will be saved.
We are given the faith to do this, we are given faith for everything, and we are to allow Jesus to work through us.
We are sealed with the Holy Spirt, God does not say this leaks, he gives all a certain amount of the Holy Spirit, it does not say in the word of God that you can lose the Holy Spirit. Sealed means sealed.  It does not dissipitate.  The Spirit works with us and we can allow it to work fully, yet once we sin we have Jesus, for the exact reason he died and rose to life, to hear our repentance and we are promised forgiveness.  This is why Jesus died on the cross and rose to life t, to bring our confession to God, who promises to forgive in this order.
 
We are to walk righteously but God knows we can sin, and Jesus is our provision for that.  Therefore fellowship is broken by grieving the Holy Spirit, and until we repent our fellowship is not so great.   It is a continual walk of refinement.  And those who think they can lose their spiritual salvation are saying they can save themselves.  

This is where free will comes into place.  And really, when living for the Lord, we are given what is needed to make the right choices, therefore, it is the will of the flesh, as Paul proclaims, and this was written about in Heidi's post, that is our soul walk, or life walk, that we allow to have power rather than what the Holy Spirit convicts us of. If Paul struggled, then I can't understand how some think we shouldn't run into struggling.  When Paul says he "might" he is not talking about his promised everlasting salvation, he is talking about the soul salvation and rewards as his example with the olympiic games and rewards.

If you separate the two, you will not have such a tough time with,  Can you lose your salvation?  The first, spiritual cannot be lost, God's words are precise.  The second, soul salvation can be lost causing loss of rewards, etc.

The power is all in looking to God's will, allowing Jesus to work through you, and keeping your hope on the Glorious Day of the Lord.    

Not expecting yourself to save yourself for the age, and ages to come.
Context, history,original mss., law of first mentioned, all are important, and of course, believing the Bible is infallible Word of God.

1 Cor 3:11-16   Explanation of salvation,works judged and consequence

For no one can lay another Foundation besides that which is laid, which is Jesus Christ.

_{Salvation first, Jesus as your Lord.}

And if, on this foundation, and one build up Gold, silver, costly stones;  wood hay, straw;

_{obviously only gold, silver, and precious stones will remain through a fire, not our works of wood, hay, and straw.}

the work of each will become manifest;  for the day will show it, because it is revelaed by fire; and so every one's work, whatever it is, the same fire will prove.

if the work of any one remain, which he built up, he will receive a recompense;

if the work of any one shall be consumed, he will suffer loss;  he himself, however, will be saved, but so as through a fire.

<sub>The believer will suffer loss if, obviously, there are only works of self and not any of God's works done through you.[/sub

Do you not know that you are a temple of God, and the spirit of God dwells among you?

Salvation first-Jesus did all the work for this everlasting salvation.  Soul salvation,( resting while the Lord works through us), can only happen once saved and it can be lost.  It seems that you are ready for the meat with this question, so now is the time to divide the Word and ask God to show you the truth.  Soul salvation begins digesting the meat.</sub>

Hi Supergoal

Hope you feel at home here  

In Christ, iconHis

Hi Jeff

and
Happy 4th of July!                        

In Christ, iconHis

Don;t forget the mustard and turnip greens and

    baked beans with a slab of bacon. mm mm mmmm! I'm a little late

so I'll cook this Friday, but I won't cook the catfish....

   any fish but catfish...

  they suck the bottom of the lakes!  

Thanks felix102! - PROMISES  We must always remember huh? and thanks for reminding me as we all need to do for each other.

I do trust, and those are the verses I base my life on, yet, I am also patient.  The thing is , is that I am willing to go in the way of the Lord's will, and I am continuing not in worry but seeking what His will is.  I am in that fuzzy place and think I am missing something, yet know that when necessary, God will provide.  I guess I just am asking for a little prayer on everybody's part because I know at times it takes a little more than what we had before and can't seem to focus at times.

I witness to people as I go through these things and give God glory saying well, I sure am thankful for all the blessings God has touched my life with.  I love to be able to do that.  It has opened up several times this last week.  But, it seems to be an urgent thing, whatever it is right now.

I believe the verses will help me to continue to focus once again.  Maybe this is where if I am the weakest, God will be the strongest, to more a degree than I have been.

Sometimes I think that I have practiced Matt.6:34 too much.  We do have to be responsible, and being the only provider is not easy, therefore, at times, we escape responsibility where we thought it would be better to do the other thing.  Yet, the other thng, I believe was a movement so deep that all I could do was stay home more until my daughter could see the light once again.  I don't know if that makes sense.

Anyway, thank you for all those verses, I will meditate and pray once more for this situation and what God wants me to do, I am so open and really want to use my talents, go where we are needed by God, or stay here if it's His will.  I just will let it go in prayer I guess.   God Bless, iconHis

Hey Araith!

Well, I will pray for you both.  Ever since I can remember, I am unable to go to church consistantly either.  Either because of a car, or a kid, or just plain ole tired because I usually work long hours per week, and Sunday is my only day off.  So when I really don't hear that alarm sometimes, I miss it.  I used to teach Sunday School, and really loved that. I loved the fellowship, and God's teachng.

It can get to you spiritually.  It's not that we are condemned, but we really need to hear the Word of God.  So I would say it's deprivation of life.  That's why I study and various other things in spare moments.  And felix is right, this forum would really be nice for her to have a little fun with us all, yet ever increasing in fellowship and learning.

There's
radio  television   books

and studies on the internet you could print out and lay
around that are uplifting or a continual study.

These might be a motivator to thirst once again.

You're on the list with all others.       In Christ, iconHis

I am in a situation, financially, that is needing an answer by the fifth of this month.  I took time to nuture my daughter, and guess what!!  She told me that she realized that God is calling her back to him and that she needs to be living for Him!  I am so glad I went on a short time of part time working so this would happen.  God's the only one that could have done this.  She ran into a young lady studying to be a missionary one day when she went to the park and went to church that night with her while I was at work.  God is so good.  I've been waiting for this and praying.  Praise God for his Love!

But, I tried other endeavors, to no avail, for extra income during this period while at home. I don't get support from my husband who is in another state.  Ah, well.... Now, you can imagine, if we miss work we are off schedule for two months in this world.  I need an answer or relief for only one more thing, or else I will be forced to move where we want sooner and on a dime.  My daughter and I want to move back to our home state.  This is not where we belong, and I can tell we are suppose to go somewhere.  So, my direction is fuzzy.  But, of course, I must consider all that's good for her because she's the one right now to raise up in the Lord.    Anyway, I need prayer for direction and financial answers.  I have worked on a few things.  But, it's just not enough.  This is not a neat situation to be in at all.  

I will be praying for all requests here and on the adm. list.  I am so sorry so many are ill and have these problems.  We really need to just pray a lot right now because these are serious burdens and illnesses.  I am so sorry for those in pain.  May God bless you with comfort and recovery.  

Love, In our Lord, Jesus Christ
iconHis

I will pray for you and the jehova witness.  

Love In Christ,
iconHis

[Salvation of the Spirit]

Here is what I have found about salvation.
Salvation of the Spirit
KJV
Ephesians 2:8,9
The actual order of wording should be:
For by Grace through faith you have been saved: and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God--
Not of works lest any man should boast

The Emphatic Diaglott
By that favor, indeed you have been saved, through the faith:  and this is not from you:  it is God's gift;
not from works, so that no man may boast:

<sub>It is evident that the Word of God tells us we have the power not to sin, yet we do sin because it is in the blood, then the struggle is between the spirit and the flesh.  
If one feels that if others sin that they are not saved, that is like saying they must work to save themselves.  

By this scripture, clearly we are told that we are given the faith to go with God's plan, which by Grace, through the faith we are saved.  It directly explains in the second statement refering back to the first statement that we are not saved by our works.   This salvation is a gift from God.

Abraham was saved by faith, yet his works were in obedience to God.  This was his life walk, or soul salvation.  We are to lose to soul in order to gain it in the kingdom.  The kingdom is not here on earth at this time. Thereare two kingdoms in the future, Christ's millenial kingdom, and then God's, and thereafter ages of ages.   This is why we are continually refined until our last day on this earth.  This is why Jesus died for our sins so we can have a relationship with God, through Him, guided by the Holy Spirit. We can repent after we are spiritually saved and are forgiven.  Of course we are to try to  walk righteously and not purposely sin thinking afterwards all we have to do is ask forgiveness.  God knows our hearts. Our life walk,( soul salvation ), is the most important aspect of our life in this age after our initial salvation.   If we work for our spiritual salvation we will never get past the stage of this age's spiritual salvation. Actually, we will not be saved.  We must believe that Jesus is God's son for our salvation from death after this life.</sub>

Diaglott
Galatians 3:4,5
However you are justifying yourself by law, are separated from Christ:  you are fallen from the favor
We however, are waiting in Spirit, for a hope of righteousness from faith.  
_{This is where the saved have fallen away from living for the Lord, working on their own and out of fellowship with God.}
Salvation of the spirit-relationship with God
Soul salvation- fellowship with God
_{Once we sin, our fellowship is broken, not the relationship
therefore, we repent after a while because once saved the Holy Spirit uplifts, guides, and convicts.  The only reason we can repent is because Jesus died on the cross for our sins.  That means all our sins, and we will sin throughout our lives.
We can only repent after we are spirituall saved.  If we repent to be saved....that is a work.  The jews were told to repent because they already had a relationship with God and they fell away.  So, when you see that, check it out, the jews are being spoken to as far as being told to repent and be baptized.  Another topic.}

All in all...

Having been justified, therefore, by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ   Romans 5:18

Quickly, the soul salvation...
_{There are many examples of soul salvation that say "might", or "hope to", to work through soul salvation.
one example:}  
Diaglott  
James 1:22  
Therefore, discarding all impurity and overflowing of malice, embrace with meekness that implanted word which is able to save your souls.

Of course, we must remember there are no works that are worthy except the works of Christ through us.  These works of the Lord through us  will be left after the fire burns off the works of wood hay and stubble.  So whatever we allow the Lord to work through us will stand at His judgment seat.  1 Corinthians Chapter three.
 
I have to finish tomorrow.

Love In Christ, iconHis

I will be back tonight on this thread after I get in a little overtime at work.  But I am extremely concerned with those who feel they can lose their salvation because their knowledge of salavation does not honor the complete perfect work of Jesus on the cross.

Is that what some of you are saying that you can lose your spiritual salvation most certainly if you sin?

There are three separate salvations, yet one on the whole.  Paul explains this.  There is a spirit salvation instantly to where you are sealed with the Holy Spirit, a soul salvation that is our life walk, losing to soul,( where we are refined until the end of our life here on earth-continual working of the Lord through us.  This is the obedience also in following his principles and commandments, such as baptism, abstaining from things that will harm us, etc..  These are works after we are saved in the way we show our love to God by trusting His perfect knowledge of whats good for us.  This is the salvation we are working through.  Even Paul did things that he struggled with.  We, by no means can be perfect.  I know I'm not losing everlasting life because I sin.  We sin all the day long.  My goodness!
Then there's a body salvation that will be redeemed at the judment seat of Christ.  
I'll be back tonight for sure to give some very interesting verses for consequences of an apostate, but surely to give some to make sure of one important thing, that salvation is everlasting by scripture.  Repentance is only for those who have sinned and never want to do that sin again.  That's our avenue for sins when they occur and we have problems with them or want the Lord to overcome them.  

Love in Christ,
IconHis

PS  I just want you to have peace in salvation.  I am really concerned for your salvation.  I hope I am mistaken in what I read.

[Proverbs 16:3]

Verses I wrote in my Bible that I received many years ago when I wanted Jesus to be Lord of my life and believed in Him.

Proverbs 16:3

Commit thy work unto the Lord, and thy thoughts shall be established.

3:5,6

Trust in the Lord with all thine heart, and lean not unto thine own understanding.

In all thy ways acknowledge him, and he shall direct they pathes.

Amen, BEP.

God, Jesus, Holy Spirit, are all one, very simple.


Colossians 1:10-19

<sub>That ye might walk worthy of the Lord unto all pleasing, being fruitful in every good work, and increasing in the knowledge of God:

Strengthened with all might, according to his glorious power unto all patience and longsuffering with joyfulness:

Giving thanks unto the Father, which hath made us meet to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in llight:

Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:

In whom wwe have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:

Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:

For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers:  all things were created by him, and for him:

and he is before all things, and by him all things consist.
and he is the head of the body, the church:  who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead: that in all things he might have preeminence.

This is the story The Almighty likes...

For it pleased the Father that in him should all fulness dwell;</sub>

Woooooooh!  It's happening as all know on this earth.  It's so hush hush by many.  Isn't it strange how quieted the obvious is and the obvious is so dangerous, life and death involving?

That's a really powerful report!  I'm too tired to read it all, saved it for tomorrow.  

Love In Christ,
iconHis

In the future...but they said it is predicted to happen too!
_{Revelation 17:16
And the ten horns which thou sawest upon the beast, these shalll hate the whore, and shall make her desolate and naked, and shall eat her flesh, and burn her with fire.}

   WHAT?!!!  Carriage to return?

        I HAVE TO GET OUT THE HORSE AND BUGGY?

I"m not believin this forum.  We need to update around here!

Thanks Blackeyedpeas    I am so relieved.  
By the way, Gates can't touch me, I have

 "Wanna Be a Millionaire Spyware Security!"      

 Love In Christ,                        iconHis

Hey carsandcandy, you should've seen it, Your handle written so many times made the whole forum message page wider than regular size.  It did make me laugh so hard! then I became verrrrrry much in fear!  But BEP, as you see, fixed it.